EP 209: Ask OV 13 - Winter Filters, Dry Stretches, and Real Talk on Calories

[00:00:00] Hey everybody, welcome back to another episode of the Live Ultralight Podcast powered by Outdoor Vitals. Today in this episode we have another episode of the Ask OV Podcast. This is a shorter form podcast where we answer listener and customer questions. These questions vary from product related questions to just backpacking related questions in general. It's been a few weeks since we had you on the mic. Both of us have been out of office a lot. What have you been up to this summer? Brigham. Before we dive into answering.

[00:00:30] Some of these actually follow up on our last OV episode that we did. So some good follow up questions. Uh, yeah, been out of the office a lot. We had, I can't remember. Yeah, I don't remember what I've said I've been doing since the last one, but a few backpacking trips. We had Colorado Trail. Uh, took my family up on a trip backpacking in Idaho, like three days or four days after that. Um,

[00:00:59] Yeah, that was a quick turn and burn. Yeah. In like a, in like a 11 day window, you slept outside like nine nights or, you know, it's like a lot of consecutive or in a tight window, a lot of nights in the mountains, which was good. Uh, yeah, other than that, when I, when I've been home, it's just been playing catch up with everything that happens when I'm out of the office. So.

[00:01:23] Yeah. I love the four seasons, but I don't know how it seems like you have to cram everything into each season, specifically summer gets extremely busy. Um, like my kids are going back into school now and I'm not too sad about it for their sake. And for my own sake.

[00:01:44] Yeah. I feel like this is one of the really busy, busy summer and it's all, it's all good. It's all doing good things. So, but yeah, it's been kind of flown by.

[00:01:57] Yeah. We'll do some trip recaps as well. We have an episode that we're going to be filming on our OB 100 hike out in Colorado and some of the highlights and low lights and just what that trip was. It was a lot of fun, but it was, it was, um, some, some adaptations needed to be made in terms of where we hiked and some things that happened along the trail. So that'll be a good one. Make sure you guys stay tuned to that one.

[00:02:23] Um, but yeah, we'll keep, we'll, uh, we'll do some more trip highlights. We've been out of office a lot, but a lot of it has been in the mountains and backpacking. I'm looking forward to some trips up to Wyoming over the next month. I plan to be up there a few times. So, um, yeah, I know you've got some, you've got a trip next week. So lots of time out. I hope you guys are also getting out in the field, but let's jump right in.

[00:02:46] Um, so first question up is a bit of a follow-up to our discussion. We had on water filters. We had a lot of comments, actually, not all questions, but just even comments about water filters and what the, the conversation is really about like air bubbles, trapping and water filters, water filters, potentially failing when you very first take them out. And, um, people just commenting on that. I think a lot of people find that really interesting and it's not something you typically think about. You typically think about you get the water filter, you take it out there.

[00:03:13] It's a brand new filter or maybe it's worked at home and, or whatever it is. And it just works when you're in the field, but it's not always the case. Um, so go back to that episode. I believe it's the ask OV episode 12. If you wanted to go listen to that, um, got a lot of buzz on that, but this is a bit of a follow-up question from Jen.

[00:03:33] Um, what about water? What, excuse me? What about winter use of water filters all summer? I've kept water filter in the mesh bag on the outer pocket of the pack from this OV 12 episode discussion. I'm now wondering how worried I need to be in the winter about filters freezing. Do you shift from keeping it inside your pack or in a jacket? I know at night to protect it, but what about hiking during the day?

[00:03:57] um pretty straightforward. Yeah. Uh, uh, uh, what I'll tell you what I do is let's just generalize it to winter. Like this comment is, uh, I just don't even use a water filter in the winter time. I don't pack one. I don't bring one. I plan on, I always pack water purification tablets. um they're called Aqua tabs.

[00:04:26] They're sold by cascade designs, which is like the parent company of like MSR and Thermarest. Uh, so I always carry those in the winter time and I just plan on melting snow. So between those two things, I don't even take a water filter in the winter time because that's yeah. Between the tablets and melting snow and carrying what I need for a day.

[00:04:52] I've never had trouble with water consumption in that way. Cause I would just rather not even worry about, you know, where do I draw the line with the water filter? Uh, if overnight lows are consistently below freezing, you know, night after night, you know, a week leading up to a trip and the forecast shows that in a trip, I just don't even bring a water filter.

[00:05:18] So let's, well, let's, let's, let's kind of dissect that just a little bit more. One of the reasons is the likelihood you find any running water to filter goes down significantly if you're in those cold of conditions. So filtering water is less likely. Um, so keep that in mind, depending on how cold the trip actually is. And if there really is going to be water to filter. Um, that being said, I'm similar to you.

[00:05:43] I'm, I usually pack in a lot of water so that I don't have to melt a lot of water because one thing that people don't realize is melting water takes a ton of gas. If you're using a gas canister stove, uh, we use titanium wood burning stoves a decent amount in the winter. And obviously with that, like, it's kind of nice. Cause you go in at like, you get into your tent at like 6 PM. Cause it's dark.

[00:06:05] And then you just sit there for hours. So you've got plenty of time to just sit there and melt snow and hang out. So we do that quite a bit with those titanium stoves. Other than that, melting snow, um, different stoves work better in the winter, but maybe we won't get into that in terms of, you know, you've been using white gas, um, stoves.

[00:06:24] And, and so there's, there's some efficiency things to focus on there, but I think maybe a slightly more beneficial thing to talk about would be what about shoulder seasons? What about like fall, early spring it's freezing at night. And so, yes, you already touched on, like we sleep with our filters typically at nighttime.

[00:06:44] What about daytime when it's like, maybe it's on the cusp, you know, of, of freezing. I know one thing that I do is just like we talked about in the last episode. I get most of the water out of my filter by like blowing in it and kind of shaking it. Now that's not, I actually have no idea whether that's even effective in helping a filter from freezing or not. It's one thing I do, but I don't know if it's effective. So one thing that I will do in these colder conditions is instead of keeping it on the outside of my bag, I'll put it on the inside of my bag, maybe even towards the back.

[00:07:14] panel of my bag. And that helps to trap in heat. It's not fluctuating temperatures as hard and as fast. Um, and if it's packed in there around clothes or, or sleeping pad, you know, stuff like that, sleeping bag, it has a little bit of insulation and a little bit of an ability to not just accidentally freeze when you're right on the line of freezing and, and not freezing. So.

[00:07:37] Yeah. Yeah. Honestly, I think that, I mean, because the, so if we walk through the practice of using a filter, let's say it's 28 degrees outside, you get to a stream, you filter some water. That is now whatever the water temperature is, combine that with the ambient temperature. That is now the maximum temperature that that water filter.

[00:08:04] That water filter will be. So even if you stick that inside a coat, like a puffy, right? That's just going to insulate. That temperature will not change. So the only way to affect or increase the temperature of that filter is with body heat. So you either put it inside a jacket pocket that you are wearing up against your body, or you will actually be able to warm up the temperature of that filter.

[00:08:30] By putting it right up against the back panel inside your pack, because your, your, your, your back will generate so much heat that you actually could potentially slightly increase the temperature of that filter.

[00:08:42] Um, but aside from body heat, like nothing else is actually going to raise that. So that's what is happening is so if you put that inside a pack wrapped up in a puffy, you're just keeping it that, at that temperature. So there's, that's just something to keep in mind, um, with whatever method you use to store and access your filter.

[00:09:07] Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Well, that gained some insight. I mean, most of the time, the daytime highs are higher than freezing. If you're getting into daytime highs lower than freezing, um, you know, that's when a filter may not be worth bringing, you know, to kind of wrap that back up. But so here's another question from Brian related to water in general. And this one is, Ooh, this one is tough. I kind of, I'll be interested to see what you say about this, but I've got my thoughts on it as well.

[00:09:37] Uh, my biggest trip planning fear and weakness is water logistics, except for far constant concentrate water spots. Do not seem to be listed as far as concrete. Sorry. Sorry. Concrete water spots. Uh, they don't seem to be listed. Top of maps go crazy with springs that seem to have dried up years ago. A little bit of help in this area would be greatly appreciated. Um, so what he's saying is like, you can look at a map and you can see water lines. You can see springs.

[00:10:06] You can see dotted water lines and you cannot just rely solely on some map saying that there is water in a drainage to actually have water in the drainage. And it is a very frustrating thing when you're expecting water to be somewhere and it's not, um, that can put you in a really bad spot. So I'll let your answer first here, Brigham, but how do you go about like handling that and dealing with that?

[00:10:36] Yeah. I mean, in the most generalized terms, I place very little trust and confidence in what I see on a map. Um, that's that I would say in the level of least confidence, that's where I would place like very low confidence.

[00:10:57] I'm going to just assign low confidence and trust to a map just because it says spring. Um, the reason that is, is because I've been in the mountains a lot and compared what I see in the mountains to what I see on a map a lot. And they almost never are the same. And so, um, little more nuances. Yes. If you look at a topographic map, um, you will see there are different markings for water.

[00:11:26] Like there will be markings on the top of map that does say spring. Um, you can look for like Taysen said, little blue lines that are sometimes dashed or dotted or solid. So dashed or dotted blue lines generally indicate a seasonal or intermittent flow of water, whether that's an inch wide or 10 feet wide. Um, but it's intermittent. Um, but it's intermittent and just consider that I consider that, that it doesn't exist.

[00:11:55] So I never, ever, ever plan or rely on a dotted or dashed water line for a water source. And I will, I would go so far as I don't even rely on something that says spring because most of the time in my experience, uh, that's never actually been the truth on the ground.

[00:12:16] Um, so if I'm going to rely on something on a map, uh, I will have increased trust and, and confidence in a solid water line, meaning like, and especially if that water line now has a name.

[00:12:32] So it says like such and such Creek or such and such brook or river. Um, obviously if something's labeled as a river, it's way more likely to be a consistent, reliable flow of water than if it says Creek. Um, but that's like my step up in confidence is a solid blue water line that says that has a named Creek to it.

[00:12:57] Um, but even then I've seen plenty of those be totally dry in, in the middle of summer and in the, in the, in the mountain West, the middle of summer should be a pretty almost maximum level of water flow. So the, the water sources in the mountain West, the Rocky mountains are all dependent on the snowpack from the year.

[00:13:22] Um, yes, there are like intermittent or seasonal monsoonal flows that happen, but for the most part, the mountains are all dependent on snowpack and snow melt. So like if it's the middle of July, that's like the best chance that exists that there will be flowing water on any marked stream or anything. So, um, I'm just saying that I've seen in the middle of July, plenty of marked streams that just aren't even there.

[00:13:49] They're not even in existence. Same thing with spring. So, um, it's tough. Uh, you know, obviously going to places that you've been before, you can start to catalog season after season, after season, after season, and have a lot of confidence in, in water, water, uh, resources. Um, and just a lot of, you just have to put a lot of personal experience and comparing that to a map.

[00:14:17] Um, now with some of the apps, um, if they're mapping applications or hiking applications, so mapping applications would be like on X all trails, um, hiking applications would be overlapping into all trails.

[00:14:34] Um, but, um, far out, far out guides. Okay. Those are, um, quite useful because if it's an established trail, uh, users are able to hike through a trail and then update and say like, Hey, I hiked past this spring on this date and there was water on it.

[00:14:56] So like on the Colorado trail, we are able to get pretty accurate, useful, pertinent information, um, that I would say sometimes did and did not jive with what was shown on on X maps, for example. And on X maps, I just want to make everyone aware, like any of these mapping softwares that you pay a subscription for part of their value proposition to us is to tell us how many features they offer.

[00:15:26] Right? So the more landmarks details that they can list on a list of, this is what they include in their mapping software. The more that seems valuable to the consumer. However, they're going to take as much map data as they can to cram into their mapping so that it seems more valuable to the consumer.

[00:15:47] But a lot of the times most of that is worthless. So like I'm definitely calling that out. Um, don't rely so much on, on a mapping software's information because a lot of it's there just so they can make a buck. Um, just so they can get you to sign up because it's, you know, if they've got 17 more features than the next mapping software, then you're more likely to sign up for their subscription.

[00:16:15] Yeah. I think too, like the better maps, if you were to look at something like on X part of their value proposition too, is like to take a lot of maps and combine things, which can mean that maybe. Maybe this like dotted blue line got put on there from a 1970s map or like this old logging trail got put in from a 1970s map, which is valuable to know that there was a logging trail here at one point, even if it's. No longer maintained and it's old and it's a bunch of fallen trees.

[00:16:44] And so there's, there's that too. Like you could be looking at a dotted blue or blue line that is just like, it's not been in existence for years and years. So, um, is it still valuable to know? Kind of like, I still like it. I still like the most detail I can possibly get on a map, but you can't just rely on it. Just like, uh, you know, Brian was alluding to here. So I kind of agree. I, I view it a little bit as a research and art form.

[00:17:11] Um, but a couple of things to note there, you know, same, I'm the same as you. I don't ever rely on a dotted blue line. Solid blue line is still very hit or miss. I look for, for names of creeks and things like that, that typically gives you a much more concrete idea if it's a bigger flowing Creek or a smaller flowing Creek. Springs can also be seasonal. Um, so that's something to note watching snowpack for the year is important because I was going to say like, oh, in general spring, you know,

[00:17:40] a lot of this is flowing and, but it's not really the case. It's more so when the snow starts to melt is your highest likelihood of finding water in all of the places or more of the places. And as early spring, not so much. And then you get into the fall and it started, everything's really drying up. Yeah. So that's also part of why I, at OV, we, we build backpacks that are capable of carrying heavier weight of water.

[00:18:08] Um, because a lot of times what I end up doing is if I'm not sure about a water source, I hope for the best, but I don't plan on it. Meaning if I, if there's not water here, I need to be able to get to the next water source that I can plan on. Um, if this one's dry. And so sometimes that does mean just packing more water for safety.

[00:18:30] Um, but I, I, um, you know, it, it, it is a spend time looking at the software, look at the maps, spend time figuring that out, pull in as much information. Are you watching multiple creeks feed into it? Um, you know, does it look like the farther you go down it, there's more likelihood to be water in case you get to the top of the drainage and there's no water. And you feel like you're going to need to, to follow it down to find water. If, if there is, um, these are all really valuable questions.

[00:19:00] There are, when you go to, you know, applications such as all trails, sometimes reviewers will give you also feedback like that. So reading reviews on trails is also really valuable. Obviously looking for actual lakes or looking for actual ponds is also a, a better way to go about it than relying on, you know, the dotted blue, the dreaded dotted blue line. Yeah.

[00:19:27] Um, so, you know, being like, okay, I have a lake in six miles. I have a potential water source and three miles. I'm going to plan to get to the lake just to be careful. And if there's water in the middle, maybe I drink extra and I, you know, or something, but, but I try to plan accordingly for what I feel is more concrete because I think running out of water is one of the more dangerous things that can happen to you in the mountains, especially depending on how far it is to get to the next water.

[00:19:57] There's even been times when I've had to completely reroute myself when water has been dry in an area and it's like, I can't get to the next water area. Now I've got to deviate my trail. I've got to deviate my plan to accommodate that. Um, so, so yeah, properly like doing the recon and research is, is really helpful. It's really frustrating, but that is part of the cost you're paying to get into the more remote sections of, you know, the mountain West.

[00:20:25] So, um, unfortunately there's not just a, you know, if it says this on a map, you're good. If it says this on a map, you're not good. Um, trail time, trail experience definitely helps, but I would spend time looking for reviews. I'd spend time really looking at the map and really thinking about the probability of water there based on snowpack and, and, and how many things are draining in there potentially. Um, just all those things definitely factor up.

[00:20:53] Hiking on a more established trail, such as the Colorado trail, the PCT. And you have an app like far out, um, very, very valuable to look at the reviews on the water sources and how early they were updated. Um, and one side note, I'll just note on that is on the Colorado trail. One thing I was noticing a lot is it was only marking water.

[00:21:16] When the trail like physically crossed the water, but sometimes there's actually water a hundred yards to the side of us and it won't mark that as water. So it's still as valuable to just be aware of the topo map itself and a hiking application such as, as far out. So, um, hopefully that gives you some context. Cause the reality is we're also figuring that out for each of our trips too.

[00:21:42] Yeah. I mean, it's, it's, it's a never ending planning and execution practice. Like there's no, there's no such thing as arriving at having now learned exactly what to do or how to solve this problem. Right.

[00:22:00] It's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's an ever present, uh, obstacle or challenge for anybody. Like we all have to drink water. Um, we all consume and, uh, our body processes water different. So like every single individual has to look at it differently. And, um, yeah, I mean it, it, it, the, the, the challenge in the fear is definitely understandable and

[00:22:25] unacknowledgeable. Um, and it just, uh, the most confidence comes from just experience, um, doing something, experiencing it, um, and, and, in all, in a variety of conditions. And so.

[00:22:40] Yeah. I think the last thing I'd say on that is you can learn a lot when you first show up to a mountain range. Right. So you're going to go into the, say the wind rivers in Wyoming. Um, like there's just a ton of water there and you can, it's quite a reliable water sources and stuff. But, you know, like a wilderness in our backyard here called the Pine Valley.

[00:23:01] If you were to show up there and you go to your first water source and you're like, dang, this is dry as a bone. Then you can look at your whole trip and be like, okay, this now means that I cannot rely on these potential water sources anymore because this mountain is dry. And then at that point, like you have to rely on the more stable or more, cause you can kind of flag water on the trail and be like, this is a potential. This is solid. This one's a lake. This one's a maybe, you know, and, and then you can plan accordingly to that, which is also

[00:23:31] why having just the ability sometimes when you show up at a trail to, um, add more water or, or carry more water. It's one of the reasons I've, I've now switched using the, the CNOC two liter, um, like water bladder. And I, I put that on the, the end of my, my, um, water filter. But what I like about having that big of a bag is, you know, not only do I have like my smart water bottles or my other bottles that I'm using, but now I've also got a two liter backup, you know,

[00:24:01] if it is really dry, I can just put dirty water in there, not filter it, carry it. And I can be hiking with, you know, five or six liters of water if I have to, but you know, if it's not that way, then I can just keep my water right at two liters or something more in that range. So having that ability to kind of scale up water carries and down, I would say is also important. And sometimes you can, you can learn what's going to be the reality, not very far down the trail for how dry the mountain is feeling and looking.

[00:24:28] And I, I would just add, uh, cause I, I think it's, it's a very real thing for a lot of people, especially the less experienced people are, the more this is a challenge. You gotta get out and do these things. You gotta try things because what I never do, because I've experienced enough is I'm never a guy that's so afraid of it that I'm walking around with three gallons of water in my backpack.

[00:24:57] Okay. That's a, that's, that's kind of an exaggeration, but I don't ever want to be even be carrying a gallon of water. Like I avoid carrying water as much as possible. The more you carry, the more weight you carry, the more you are exerting yourself and the more water demands you're placing on your body.

[00:25:15] So I try to carry no more than two liters of water at any given time as much as possible. I carry more than that. If the conditions and the route ahead is telling me I should probably carry a little bit more than this, but that's the, the, the big thing is don't let fear make you carry so much water that now you're going to wear your body out and not have a good experience.

[00:25:43] Um, and it's just, there's a lot of nuance in there. There's a lot of trial and error that has to take place. Um, but I would say like that should be the goal is to not carry a, you know, more water than you really need to.

[00:25:58] Mm-hmm. Okay. Hopefully that was helpful, Brian. Um, I've got another question here. It's a little more related to food and it's kind of a follow-up question, I believe to, uh, an episode we did from Christine.

[00:26:13] She says, I plan for 1500 to 1700 calories a day for my one to five day hikes. And then for six days, plus I packed 2300 per day. So I'm not sure exactly why that varies with her, but I don't eat processed food. So I don't really do snacks. I take beef sticks and some homemade trail mix for midday and that's it. Uh, I don't find it necessary to take so many calories. I've never felt like I needed more than that.

[00:26:40] So she's probably referring to the fact that in, in the past, um, we've shared some of the amount of calories that we take on, on hikes and on the Colorado trail that we just went on. I was carrying about 4,000 calories per day. Um, sometimes even a hair more. And then she's, uh, you know, so she's over here saying like, well, on my hikes like this, I'm only taking, you know, 1600 calories.

[00:27:04] So that's why I, I do try anytime that I'm referring to the amount of calories I eat. I try to give context context. I think really matters. So I don't really know Christine. She could be 120 pound gal. She could be somewhere in a totally different range, but I'll try to say like, look, I'm a 200 to 210 pound, six foot two guy. Like I, I need more food to do what I need to do.

[00:27:26] I'll also give context in terms of how many miles I'm doing a day, what the trip itinerary is. My own demands go up and down. If I'm doing a low exertion trip, yeah, I'm carrying more like 3000 calories.

[00:27:40] But if I'm doing a very high exertion trip, I like to have 4,000 calories. Um, and that's something I have personally dialed in over time. The other factor here too, is like what the exertion is, right? If you're doing Grand Canyon rim to rim to rim, and you are climbing massive amounts and descending massive amounts and not walking that much flat trail at all.

[00:28:03] That's a different level of calorie need than walking on a paved flat road. Right. And so I think the context really matters here. And it's something that, that takes time to dial in, but it also like, you just got to think ahead, kind of like with the water plans, you've got to think ahead of what is this trip? How much exertion am I doing? Um, my own personal body, how much, you know, calories do I need? Because even between me and Brigham, we will give you different answers on how many calories we take on trail. Like on the Colorado trail, you usually water.

[00:28:32] I don't count. I don't count. I don't count. I don't count. I don't count. I don't pay attention to it. Do you weigh your food? No. You don't weigh your food. You just pick meals and snacks. Yep. I pick food that I want to eat. And if I eat it, I'm fine. How many times do you get to the end of the day and have too much food?

[00:28:55] Hmm. It's not, it's not, it's not really much. It's not very frequently. Um, in my mind, I, I think, um, I, I would like to end up with probably 10%, 10 to 15% more food than I needed. Um, there's, that's just a buffer, but I don't, I mean, I don't count my calories. I don't weigh my food.

[00:29:21] Um, I, I have a general idea because I've walked the earth for some years and done this a lot. So like, I have an idea like what has what in it, you know, what, like what a slice of bread or a tortilla or a piece of cheese might have in it, but I don't count it. Um, and I don't weigh it.

[00:29:41] And I just think that's to your point is food is absolutely an individual thing. So if anybody just heard me say, I don't count my calories or weigh my food, that's not me recommending to you, the listener to not count your calories or weigh your food. And I would say just because Tayson says he packs 4,000 calories does not mean we think you should pack 4,000 calories, or at least I don't think you should pack 4,000 calories.

[00:30:09] Everybody knows themselves. Um, and to this, to this gal, like to me, I read this and sound like she's confident in what she does. Because there's like, I would not recommend she do anything differently than, than she says there, but to the listener, I wouldn't also recommend to the listeners to not listen to what Christine said here and take that as what you should do.

[00:30:32] Um, now that there's, there's just so much individuality and has, has to be self-awareness. There has to be, there's, there's different levels of experience. And like met Taysom mentioned, like those, those variables that he mentioned, like those are really important variables to pay attention to and relate to oneself.

[00:30:54] Um, so that, that, that, that's my take on, on this is like, everybody needs calories to function, especially backpacking. So what that number is for me, Tayson or anybody else is going to be different. That's my take. Yeah. Um, I think as you go through the list of, of what people bring on our trip and you look at how much food they bring for each day,

[00:31:19] every one of our group on the Colorado trail had a different amount of food, slightly different strategy for them. Some made more meals themselves or even snacks themselves. Some made zero themselves. Um, some pack, you know, like me more, maybe more 4,000 calories. Some are well under three. Um, but it's, it is definitely individual. And again, I do tailor it to the exertion required.

[00:31:45] Uh, cause I, there's been times when I've got out there and I've been under or I've been over and I've been able to pattern that depending on what is my output for the day. What am I, what am I doing in the day? So tailor that I appreciate this comment. I wanted to include this comment and question mainly because I wanted to bring in the other end of the spectrum of, you know, counted calories and what works for people.

[00:32:09] So, um, so much to like Brian's question, there is a bit of an art form here to water consumption, to food consumption and just knowing yourself. Um, but what I would probably finish this with is I would never, there has been times when the OCD part of my brain has counted calories to the max. And, and like really made that a point.

[00:32:38] And that got to a point where it was starting to take away from my trips because planning the food became a big obstacle for me, just grabbing a bag and heading out there. And I think that was also like me taking it too far. Right. Um, you know, Brigham, obviously, you know yourself really well. And part of why I imagine you've consciously or unconsciously got to where you're at is because it's easy, it's convenient, and it's not a hurdle anymore.

[00:33:08] It's not a, it's not something that takes a ton of time and planning to do. Um, and I think there's value in that. So over planning, overdoing it here. Um, don't let that be an obstacle to you actually just getting out there and doing it. Cause even like on my wind rivers trip where I forgot a substantial amount of food in my cooler, in my car, um, still the trip still, it was an awesome trip. I loved it. Um, I was hungry at times. Absolutely.

[00:33:32] But, um, was able to just take the food I had divided up throughout the day and still execute the trail that I had planned to do. And I wouldn't have done it any other way in hindsight. So don't let it become an obstacle. Great questions. Um, if you guys have more questions on any of these topics or any others, make sure to drop them in the comments on the YouTube channel. Email us in a support out or vitals, open up a chat on our website.

[00:33:57] Um, or down the link to this episode, you'll find a link to speak pipe where you can record an audio question for us to answer, um, in our next episode. So any last thoughts? No, good, good, uh, topics for discussion for sure. Yeah. All right. Appreciate it. Like subscribe and we'll catch you guys in the next episode.